MAYAVADIS, PARAMATHMAVADIS AND DEVOTEES – DIFFERENCES!!
A male devotee (Name hidden) asked like this:
(1) if someone takes diksha from a person who is mayavadi, what is his fate? Actually I know an institution where guru says that Lord Ram is nirakaar and even they are parmatamavadis say that even we have to realize Krishna within. What is wrong in their philosophy. Though I know iskcon fight mayavadi. what about parmatamavadis. Even Krishna gives them intelligence to see Krishna within himself. How will they realize Krishna in personal form.
(2) It is known that neophytes consider only Krishna in deity form. Even madhyama and uttama adhikari consider Krishna in deity form. Is it that uttama adhikari sees Krishna in everyone heart. What is difference between parmatamavadis and uttama adhikari. Both sees Krishna as parmatama.
Let me explain the differences between MAYAVADIS, PARAMATHMAVADIS AND DEVOTEES for your understanding.
Krishna, as a person says that He is the Adhi Purusha and created all the creations.
(My father being a sunyavadi discourages me from Krishna Consciousness. What to do? READ HERE!)
This shows that Krishna is primarily a person. He has a beautiful form and in His form only, he created humans with limited capacity.
Then, what is the need for the existence of MAYAVADIS, PARAMATHMAVADIS AND DEVOTEES?
We, the humans have forms.
We are also the tiny parts and parcels of Krishna’s body.
If the creations have forms, the creator should also have a form.
This is easily understandable.
(Krishna, Paramathma and Brahmam – Who is the Origin? A-Z Details! READ HERE!)
So, primarily, Krishna has a form. Since only a supreme person can create innumerable persons, Krishna should have a form.
Krishna is also capable of appearing in different forms and even as tiny formed Paramathma.
That is why, when Krishna wanted to create material creations, He expands as three vishnus:
1) Maha-Vishnu who creates innumerable universes,
2) Garbhodakashayi Vishnu who enters each universe and creates all the planetary systems, and
3) Ksirodakashayi Vishnu who enters the hearts of all beings, as well as into each atom of the universe.
Remember, the original supreme person Krishna expands as three forms.
(If Krishna directs us as Paramathma from our heart as per Gita, does He direct our bad deeds also? READ HERE!)
The Ksirodakasayi Vishnu who resides in the hearts of all the living beings is called Paramathma.
Now, it is clear.
Krishna is the First Person – Adhi Purusha – The Supreme Personality of Godhead.
Paramathma is the form He accepts when he enters into the hearts of every person.
This means that Krishna, as a person is the source and Paramathma is His expansion.
This again shows that we can SEE Krishna, the Person.
Whereas, we can FEEL Paramathma who is residing within our heart.
(Nature Of Athma (Soul): Can the athma (Soul) feel, see, speak and work? READ HERE!)
BRAHMAM or BRAHMAN or BRAHMA JOTHI is, the BRIGHT SPACE AROUND KRISHNA ILLUMINATED BY THE BODY OF KRISHNA HIMSELF.
Some concepts are based on this Brahmam that say that Krishna is formed from this Brahmam. This is very difficult to accept because “a form can illuminate a space”, but, “a SPACE can’t form a person Krishna”.
So, we can conclude that Krishna is the source and the Brahmam is His illuminated space.
Here, we are not talking about this Brahmam. We are bothered about Paramathma that is the expansion of Krishna.
The analysis above shows that Paramathma is the expansion of Krishna. So, instead of targeting Brahmam, targeting the Paramathma is better.
Thus, Paramathmavadis, ie, those who target Paramathma are better than Mayavadis who target Brahmam.
However, targeting Paramathma is not equal to targeting Krishna Himself who is the source of that Paramathma.
(When Krishna instructs a person to help others, how can we say that Krishna does not direct us as Paramathma from heart? Read Here!)
Targeting Krishna is targeting the Original Person, the source. Targeting Paramathma is targeting the expansion of the Original Person Krishna.
Thus, targeting Krishna is Superior because we target the Original Person Himself and we can involve in lilas with Krishna or witness them. That means, we can see Krishna with ALL His qualities
By targeting the Supreme Person, we can feel His qualities, lilas, actions, speeches, etc. We can also Serve Him. It is not possible in Paramathma form as He is within our heart.
That is why, Vaishnava Sampradhayas encourage us to worship Krishna as a Person.
You have said that even Madhyama and Uththama adhikaris see Krishna as Paramathma in everyone’s heart.
Yes. They do not primarily worship Krishna as Paramathma in everyone’s heart. They just recognize that Krishna is there in the form of Paramathma also within every living entity. They take it as a supporting point to respect all the living beings.
(Athma (Soul) and Paramathma (Supersoul)- Differences! READ HERE!)
Since they are already tasting the lilas of Krishna as a Person, there is no ned for the devotees to settle to see Krishna as Paramathma. They are already in the topmost form of worship of the actual Person Krishna.
Just because we worship Krishna as the Supreme Person, will we disrespect Sri Sampradhaya just because they worship His Narayana/ Vishnu form? They do not speak much about the lilas of Krishna and worship the revered form of Krishna as Vishnu. Gaudiya vaishnavas worship Krishna in His actual form along with His lilas, qualities, etc. This enables the devotees to develop a close relation with Krishna as wished by him/ her.
Our primary target is Krishna. They target Narayana or Vishnu form. The Paramatmavadis target Krishna’s Paramathma form. However, since they are also connected with Krishna’s forms, we accept them.
Similarly, the primary target of Madhyama, Uththama or even Kanishta adhikaris is Krishna only and in His original form. They respect all other forms of Krishna also.
(Read about the Three classes of devotees in detail HERE!)
Krishna expands as three Vishnus to create all the material creations. So, all His forms are also directly connected to Krishna. So, we honour them too.
A devotee who worship Krishna’s Personal form can feel the Paramathma expansion also. But, a Paramathmavadi can not feel the Personal form of Krishna.
Because, Krishna is the source; Paramathma is His expansion.
Source includes expansion; An expansion does not include the source.
Example: The sun includes its rays; The individual ray does not include the sun.
Therefore, a Krishna devotee (any adhikari) can also identify Krishna as Paramathma in everyone’s heart.
But, a Paramathmavadi feels Krishna, only in the form of Paramathma.
If a Paramathmavadi says that he is seeing Krishna in personal form also, he is no more a Paramathmavadi. He who sees Krishna in Personal form is a direct devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead Krishna.
In all the above considerations, worshiping Krishna in His Personal form is the topmost form of devotion.
So, a “Devotee” feels more spiritual bliss compared to a “Paramathmavadi”.
Your first question: Taking diksha is just an igniting or initiating process. Though he takes diksha from a mayavadi, he can follow devotion to Krishna as a person. Sri Caitanya Maha Prabhu too took sanyasa diksha from a mayavadha guru. But, he preached against mayavada. Isn’t it?
Hope my simple explanation has cleared your doubts on the diferences between MAYAVADIS, PARAMATHMAVADIS AND DEVOTEES!
(Why Krishna does not correct us if He is within our hearts? READ HERE!)